Here is a message that I recently wrote to an anonymous exgay individual who said it was “the gay scene” — which, he said, seemed to consist of sad, lonely, self-centered, manipulative people — that made him pursue reparative therapy. It was apparent to me that he was still lonely and weighing his options.
There is no one gay scene; it sounds as though you have focused solely on a “singles scene,” not a “gay scene.” Loneliness and dysfunction are not hard to find among both the gay singles and hetero singles scenes.
Finding potential relationships is tough for gay people, because there they are not easy to identify in a crowd. But that general, nonsexual crowd is often where solid romantic relationships evolve. People happen to meet over shared interests and hobbies, not sex. They come to know each other, and things click. Have you sought out friendships in ordinary settings — sports groups? church/synagogue? book clubs? video game teams? What are your hobbies? Have you sought out friends who share your interests, or have you ought out people just because they call themselves gay?
If you’re tired of self-centered people, then there are some simple steps to take.
1. If you find that those around you are self-centered, don’t hang out there. Skip the bars and singles chat rooms, for example — they cater to lonely individuals (gay and straight) with little in common.
2. Beware of your own potential self-centered tendencies when you judge someone else.
Sometimes there will be a situation where Person A decides that Person B is self-centered, not because B is really selfish, but because B didn’t focus primarily on meeting A’s needs.
Other times, B talks about his interests not because he’s not interested in A’s interests and wellbeing, but because A is really shy and not disclosing or sharing his own interests.
Sure, there are a lot of self-centered men, too. If you think it is the “gay” rather than the “man” that is self-centered, then I encourage you to talk with women about all the selfish men that they’ve dated — or married. I have found women all too eager to share with me their stories about selfish heterosexual men. (And I have found that many women are selfish, also.)
But many women eventually find unselfish men, and so could you, if you want to. I’m just not certain whether you really want to — or need to, if you are also attracted to women.
Whichever way you go, here’s my advice:
Instead of looking for people on the basis of sexual orientation, or in the “singles” scene, I’d recommend meeting ordinary people in a variety of ordinary settings that interest you, based on your hobbies. Meet people because they are people, not because they are gay. If some of your friends eventually turn out to be gay, so much the better — you’ll already have built a friendship based on complementary nterests and trust.
Don’t make such a big deal out of your sexual attraction/orientation. And don’t waste time on the singles “scene.” Whether someone is gay or straight, the trick to not being lonely is to find ways to be yourself and to socialize normally while going about activities that interest you.
[Troll post deleted by moderator. Exgay and antigay posts are OK at Ex-Gay Watch; irrational and disruptive tirades are not.]
I think this is wise advice and I hope he takes it to heart. Maybe at least it will start him thinking in a new direction. Wouldn’t it be awful if everyone – gay or straight – got their impressions of the world from singles bars? I do think it has historically been much worse for gays. When the attraction you feel is considered a perversion by the masses, it tends to cause a lot of social and personal dysfunction.
I remember vividly my first visit to a gay bar. Sex was not even on my mind (that came later). I just knew that if I went in, there would be other gay people around me and I had to do it – I was so tired of being lonely in a crowd. I wish I had pictures – it turned out to be a hard-core leather bar and I was trying my best to fit in. This was my first real picture of gay life! Even so, after a few beers it wasn’t so bad 😉
I’m talking to much…
David
David:
LMAO, that must of been awkward.
Just to add to the advice, I also think it’s important not to judge a book from its cover. Although I don’t think the person for who the advice was for would be interested in men into leather, they could make very good friends in life (out of the scene of course). I know some bears and guys into leather that are very decent and nice people. Don’t let these people intimidate you!
DFTT
Xeno said:
I also think it’s important not to judge a book from its cover
It was just that, as my first experience and after having to summon all my nerve just ot go in, it did leave an impression! I met a lot of interesting people during my bar hopping days – leather and all. I remember a nice old guy (construction worker) who didn’t look half bad in a black evening dress. He/she used to watch out for me. You can meet a great bunch of people if you don’t mind looking past the surface, I agree.
David
I was lucky I guess. The first bar I went into was in a little big town (San Jose) and the scene was more about making friends and community and less about hooking up. I remember being very shy and a bit afraid to hang out on the boy side of the bar, so I hung out by the lesbians and they tought me to play pool. Ah, happy memories.
And going out to the local bar was about meeting up with the group of guys and gals you had come to know. Sunday afternoons and Wednesday nights I knew I would always have someone to talk to if I showed up to Club St. John.
But I learned that socializing outside bars was essential. It was birthday parties and Thanksgiving dinners, political groups and religious groups, roommates and friends, and the outside stuff that made me happy and content. Not cruising the “bad places”.
But I guess part of that is self fulfilling. If you hate yourself and hate being gay, you aren’t going to join the Pride Parade committee. If you don’t want to know anyone gay other than a quick anonymous tussle, you aren’t going to make spaghetti or go see a movie with some guy you met just as a friend. And, of course, if you have no gay friends they can’t introduce you to this guy they aren’t into but would be perfect for you.
Timothy, it is always refreshing to hear a voice of reason!
My first “bar experience” was in Chicago’s Boystown neighborhood. I knew I wasn’t going to meet the love of my life there, but I also found out other places to meet people who just might share some common interests, values, likes, dislikes, you name it. I also made some lifelong friends. I had to do a little checking out of other “scenes” but I quickly met someone who shares a common ethnic background, values, customs, and interests. We have a difference in religous backgrounds, but it’s not that huge and we are both religous people.
I don’t know what Jeff’s experiences were, but I’d venture to guess he approached them with a negative attitude and got a negative result! But for that to continue for 30 years tells me that he is not a person who learns from his mistakes nor is he someone who learns quickly or readily.
Pity really.
I think I’ve told this one before, but so what.We didn’t meet in a bar. Or through friends. Or anywhere “gay” actually.We met in a park!!!Now, before that starts sounding gruesome or anything, it was beside a park. And it was broad daylight, with people everywhere.A warm early autumn evening, I was riding home from work. He was walking home from shopping. We looked at each other as I rode past, and he smiled, and I smiled. So I stopped and we began talking (2hrs…) And walked toward home, exchanging numbers. That’s how difficult it was :)Hmmm, how would an exgay avoid a “gay pick-up joint” like that? Become a hermit?(Botanic Gardens, Shrine of Rememberence, Birdwood Ave — if you need directions).
DFTT
I agree with the advice to start by meeting people who share common interests rather than trying to find potential dates. I first met my partner of five years in a Sunday school class for young adults at our church. It is a welcoming congregation with lots of different kinds of people. I didn’t ask him out for a date until I figured out he was gay, which took awhile (I was new to the church and didn’t bother to ask). That time wasn’t wasted because we were having a good time just hanging out and becoming friends. Happily, the romantic part happened soon enough.