Wayne has posted some photos from yesterday’s NARTH/Exodus protest. They’re kind of blurry but I swear that’s Randy “boy wonder” Thomas in the orange. Alan “Batman” Chambers doesn’t appear in the pics.
In case you’re wondering why the Batman nicknames, just watch Randy’s hilarious introduction for a speech he gave to the Florida Family Policy Council. His sense of humor really shines through and really made me think what a sweet likable guy he must be apart from Exodus’ public rhetoric.
Randy is a likable guy actually. He gets really gets angry and defensive when you ask him questions he can’t or doesn’t want to answer.
Overall, I’d probably enjoy going to Disneyland or a movie with him but I can’t let the fact that he’s a fun person cloud my feelings about the work he does.
One day I hope he realizes just how much he’s being used by a much bigger machine.
And if you manage to get through to the end, we get an answer to some previous posts straight between the eyes, nice and clear.
Asked what the “terminolgy” should be, Randy replied “Right now I’m using gay identified…”.
Because… “… it’s that throwing in that qualifier and getting people to asks questions…”
So it’s confirmed. Exodus’ use of “gay identified” has the purpose of making other people question whether or not gay men and women really are gay.
Sorry Daniel. But that’s entirely deliberate and manipulative behaviour from that “sweet likable guy”.
That’s exactly how I felt, they’re trying to redefine the word “gay.” And then the part where he finally came to the realization that heterosexual marriage was the best way to go… for the children!?
They also forgot to mention how we don’t drink the blood of children or have sex with animals.
Or did I miss that? I had to go throw up once.
Just for the record, if you look at Randy’s whole speech, he is very aware of homophobia in the Christian community and he repudiates it. Sure, his main reason for that is so that Christians can be more effective in their “outreach,” but at least, unlike other conservative Christians, doesn’t pretend that it doesn’t exist. He also avoids using distancing terms like “homosexual” in everything, like the AFA uses on everything. “Gay-identified” at least acknowledges that we prefer the term “gay” and that we identify as “gay.” I don’t expect Exodus types to just call us “gay.” They’re just not going to do it.
As much as I oppose everything Randy teaches about us — and as silly as Exodus is with this absurd protest, especially since they don’t supply study results, do follow-ups of people who’ve gone through their “therapies” or conduct controlled studies of any kind, he isn’t a hater.
It’s too bad that he doesn’t see how protests like this along with his support of anti-gay legislation, including turning the constitution against us, works against that goal. His very work creates a climate of hate, no matter what his words say.
But I think to pick on terms like “gay-identified” is misdirected. There are people with same sex attraction who “identify” as gay and people who do not. I don’t think it’s the worst label I’ve ever been called.
I’m going to agree with Steve on this one. . .for Exodus, “gay-identified” may almost be a step in the right direction. It says, “Look, there are gays, and then there are the gays who call themselves gay.” From their standpoint, that makes an ex-gay become a regular “gay (non-identified).” Exodus’ problem, in their eyes, isn’t so much the eradication of homosexuality as a new phenomenon, but the eradication of homosexuality as a newly accepted phenomenon. If the enemy isn’t gay people but gay people who are willing to be gay, then that leaves the Alan’s and Randy’s of the world safe.
Steve and Cyrano,
I can appreciate and for the most part agree with what you guys said. And for the record I did listen to the whole thing the first time and just listened to it again. These are some of the reasons why I just don’t accept his gift wrapped garbage. He’s a shill. Whether or not he realizes it is irrelevant, he’s spreading LIES and it’s unacceptable. The fact that he’s not a hater makes the situation worse. He’s a lie packager’s dream.
(Partial transcript, paraphrased as best I could.)
Randy on Exodus…
-Redeem people out of the homosexual lifestyle.
-To overcome homosexuality through a relationship with Christ.
-What it means to overcome the group think mantras of what it means to be “gay.”
-We have determined, first of all what it takes to develop a sexual orientation to begin with, and -then how to overcome the lies that keep people stuck in that.
-what sexual orientation is and how sexual behavior can be stewarded for the glory of God.
-Since Alan Chambers has become president it has become clear that the foundational state of Exodus is complete and now we are seeking to influence and increase our culture for Christ.
Translation: No one on Earth who is “gay identified” is also Christian. If they say they are, then that is PROOF of their “sexual” delusion.
Not only are we too STUPID to realize we should be attracted to what revolts us the most but we are also just too stupid to realize that THEY, know better than us, about God’s relationship with us!
THERE IS NO POSSIBLE GREATER INSULT THAN THAT.
-The abject and absolute dismissal of the most SACRED thing in a persons life. -This coming from a so called Christian.
-That was the principle of his ENTIRE speech – ‘I know God better than they do because I don’t have sex with guys anymore.’ That is everything that man has to stand on.
-No different than you or I while we’re not having sex, except for the fact that we don’t think there’s anything wrong with ourselves.
They are literally attempting to take away our religious freedom by legally defining us as too STUPID to know what God/Jesus/or Love means. We’re too stupid to know what religion itself means!
_______________
-We are coming against the spiritual principalities that ensnare people with same sex attraction into a pigeon hole of identity and again, group think mantras. We are going to make a cultural difference.
-We can bridge the gap between what conservatives are saying and what the gay community is saying. And the reason we can do that is because we lived there.
-If you cannot love your gay opponent, gay identified opponent…
—-
-Gay rights, how did we get here?
-Was it because of sound research, no.
-Was it because of sound policy arguments, no.
-sound sociological arguments, no, they’re just beginning those.
_______________
-I’m 36, when I was 19, (in the eighties), my gay friends were dropping like flies.
-I was a teen sneaking into the gay bars and every week another friend died, from something.
-His conclusion is that the gay community is fighting with the his “Christian” community because of how the Religious big wigs responded to the AIDS crisis in the eighties by blaming gays for the disease.
________________
-We press on as we have to in this public policy fight, do as much investing in redemption as we do in opposing an agenda. Is that right? No. Is that fair? Doesn’t matter. Jesus went the extra mile.
-Because the first and foremost thing you need to get your head around is that these are not gays and lesbians, they are men and women. And they need to know Jesus.
-The gay rights movement is here because of their ability to pull at the heartstrings and the fairness of our leaders. We can do that too.
-I know what it’s like to be called a sickie, I know what it’s like to be called a fag…
He goes on to talk about how he had a lover, was going to have huskies live in Tennessee and grow old together and what it means to “define your love like that.” But in his heart he knew that heterosexual marriage was the best for society….”and children.”
So we are here to help you. Let us offer our expertise in this area. And we will make a difference for Christ.
________________
Question:
How do we respond to people born gay or choose the lifestyle?
Randy -No genetic proof of born gay, BUT, even if it were to be proved that people were born that way, that doesn’t make it a moral right, I was born with a mole right there (points to shoulder)… Cancer they’re saying is genetic.
1. There’s no straight gene either, necessary to make the assertion that sexual orientation is genetically based. LIE!
2. The absence of scientific evidence trumps my first hand eyewitness that I was born this way. Therefore everyone like me is an IDIOT!
3. Aren’t these the same people who believe in the “myth” of evolution?
-They’re picking and choosing from science in order to support what they pick and choose from the Bible! Hypocrites!
________________
-I did not choose to struggle with homosexuality, to have the gender confusion that I HAD, and this is where I think we can start flipping their words back on them, I do have a choice in how I live my life. Just because I have same sex attraction, in my background, does not mean I ever have to identify as gay ever again. And there are many people who would rather live their lives through the filter of their faith and not their sexuality.
…buy into the gay identity and the group think and the paradigm of beliefs that comes with that. One of the first things the lord said to me was that homosexuality was your idol. So when we’re out there, just because we have same sex attraction, doesn’t mean we have to believe in what the “gay elite” “tells me I have to believe in.” We’re undermining the whole group think that goes on with that.
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Comment/question
…in our book “Marriage on Trial,” it’s not a choice, God made us complicated, it’s not an easy answer.
-I’m assuming that was either Stanton or Maier talking. Have your read that book? It’s a plethora of double speak and hypocrisy. These people are either consciously willfully lying through their teeth, or are so stupid that they shouldn’t be driving let alone voting or setting policy for the lives of others. One of their arguments against gay marriage is that it would fragment the gay community by making ‘haves and have nots’ of us. That’s before they make the case that were a bunch of sickos who die early and invented sexually transmitted diseases, the ONLY place in the book where there IS NO FOOTNOTE.
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And, “Group Think.” Perpetuating the MYTH of the monolithic “Gay Agenda.” But without saying so. “Group Think” is the redefinition of Gay Agenda. It MEANS the same thing!
What it comes down to is the fact that what he is saying is NOT TRUE! Just because he is nice or even confused about what he is saying makes it not only NO LESS OF A LIE, but furthermore he makes a superior WEAPON for the intentional liars. -He is a weak peg being used for the intention of MALICE. He needs to be taken OUT!
People are KILLING THEMSELVES because of the information he is peddling, there is NO excuse! It’s the NICENESS of his and the Ex-gay movement’s rhetoric that is the lynchpin of the Anti-Gay-Religious-Hatred-Movement.
It’s scumbuckettry like his that continues to justify the expectation of me to live the rest of my life miserable and alone.
I nearly killed myself once because of scum like him and I’m not about to stop and wonder now, ‘gee, I wonder if he was smart enough to know that it was wrong to BURN-DOWN-MY-HOUSE when he was told to do so (literally) “for Christ’s sake”…’
We’ll have plenty of time to sort out the mitigating “niceness” of his CHOSEN BEHAVIOR at the trial.
Emproph, I don’t disagree with your assessment — and I have been very hard on Randy in our personal emails and in public. He represents everything I personally stand against. I told him to his face that he gives conservative Christians “cover” to feign love by pretending that turning the constitution against us doesn’t mean they don’t love us.
But I also recognize that there will ALWAYS be anti-gay religious people. If they are part of Exodus then they will have influence on the straight conservative Christian movement. I would rather have someone standing there telling them not to hate their “gay-identified” neighbors than telling them otherwise. Randy encourages them to get involved in the lives of gay people.
In my experience, when gay-haters actually get involved in our lives and make friendships, they lose a lot that bigotry that comes from ignorance. For every Randy who gets converted over to the dark side of Christian fundamentalist theology through personal interaction, I know many more conservative Christians who learn that we are not the satanic forces of evil that they had imagined us to be.
Randy, in one of this speeches (and I don’t recall if it was this one) said to them, “When you look at your gay-identified neighbor, see me.” He refuses to let his listenership see us as some alien “other.” Whatever toxicity comes from the rest of his teaching, I’d rather have someone who does that than someone like Peter LaBarbra who cannot open his vile mouth without spewing hatred and lies, and empowering conservative Christians into deeper levels of bigotry and violence.
Everything Randy teaches, theologically, is disgusting to me. His political actions are enormously harmful to my home and my family, but he’s not training people to hate the way some leaders on that side are. And I think it doesn’t hurt to acknowledge this.
My opinion only.
In my experience, For every Randy who gets converted over to the dark side of Christian fundamentalist theology through personal interaction, I know many more conservative Christians who learn that we are not the satanic forces of evil that they had imagined us to be.
-Randy, in one of this speeches (and I don’t recall if it was this one) said to them, “When you look at your gay-identified neighbor, see me.” He refuses to let his listenership see us as some alien “other.”…
I’d rather have someone who does that than someone like Peter LaBarbra… And I think it doesn’t hurt to acknowledge this.
Thanks Steve, I appreciate the perspective and I take it to heart.
Steve, I too appreciate your perspective. Thank you for encouraging us to look at many facets of this. I still, like you, think much of what he says is toxic, with that veneer of love. But you’re right – I’d rather have him speaking about us than Peter LaBarbera if I had to choose. On the other hand, I wish it didn’t feel so much like choosing the lesser of two evils.
No, Randy doesn’t hate us, but at a very deep level he hates himself. Reading his blog is almost unbearably sad.
What’s interesting about Randy is that in his story about his coversion, he talks about having made an “idol” of homosexuality. So what does he do now? He worships heterosexuality. His absolute idolatry of straight sex and his need to worship at the feet of heterosexuals to get their approval is what I find sad.