The webmaster for Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays, Gabriel Espinosa, has been cited by Box Turtle Bulletin for his use of the F word (and little else besides the expletive) in correspondence with public officials about what constitutes fair access by transgendered persons to gender-specific restrooms.
Espinosa’s only suggestion for those who seek fairness for transgendered persons:
Hopefully, it will be one of your daughters who gets raped first!
Previous XGW coverage of Gabriel Espinosa.
Other coverage: Wayne Besen
Now I’m positive that Regina Griggs was lying about the PFOX fiasco a while back. These people are totally out of their gourds, and holocaust revisionists to boot.
OMG, imagine using the “F” word! I guess that is reserved for liberals’ use only?
How professional of Gabriel.
Jim in the Christian home in which I grew up, you didn’t use Oh My God, let alone the “F word…
OMG, imagine using the “F” word! I guess that is reserved for liberals’ use only?
No offense guy, but are you sure you’re a therapist? Are you sure you’re not, like, 12?
Doesn’t singer Cindy Lauper have a song called “True Colors?”
Yeah, but that song is about showing your POSITIVE true colors. This chick is just kwazy.
“…reserverd for liberals only?”
When you lift yourself higher than God, people will hold you to that standard.
The ‘F’ word? Our Saviour says you would recognize the tree by its fruit. I just never realise how easy it would be to recognize it and how stinky the fruit is!
How true! Perhaps the only way to get people to address the issue is when a pre-op transgender male gets raped in a guys washroom!
* Mike Airhart, correct me if I am wrong; but the use of the word transgendered in this post is actually the incorrect term to address the gender identity variant community. Pardon me, but I am sure no one wants to be called gayed or lesbianed, or homosexualed.
What do you expect from a guy who also makes such intellectual remarks as:
People who use the word “liberal” like it’s the F-word can’t even give a cogent definition for the label. I have two conservative friends – one, in fact, who is VERY conservative – and both support equal rights for GLBT people. One is even opposed to abortion.
–Unless support for LGBT equality is only reserved for “liberals.” Then I guess they’re some sort of “halfsie.”
There is no excuse for Gabriel’s comments. I wouldn’t wish rape on my worst enemy—abominable. And, his language is also inexcusable.
Thanks, Alan.
We can agree on something.
Boo, I swear (oops, sorry to swear, Alan) I am at least 12; at least that’s what my ID says, and the last time I checked I was still a therapist. But on some days I am a Muay Thai artist.
But you’re a therapist For NARTH Jimmy. I love this little ditty from your website;
“… gays indoctrinate innocent, impressionable children to accept a lifestyle that will harm them…”
Real educated claim there sweety. Oh yeah, I hold a sixth dan in both Shito Ryu Karate and Kendo when I’m not posting here. ::Falls off my chair laughing::
Boo, I swear (oops, sorry to swear, Alan) I am at least 12; at least that’s what my ID says, and the last time I checked I was still a therapist. But on some days I am a Muay Thai artist.
Well, between Nicolosi joking about dropping babies on their heads so they’ll be brain damaged but notgay, “scientific advisors” advocating child abuse, defending slavery, and claiming tolerance education causes brain damage, and the whole “I wish I knew how to quit you” thing they’ve got going with Paul Cameron, I guess you’re the kind of therapist who’d fit right in. It’s been a couple months since the last major NARTH scandal, would you consider writing some essays for their website?
Alan: welcome back. Thank you for your remarks on rape.
Jim P: I read your apology in another thread. Thank you for going an extra mile for the many readers.
“Transgender” is actually the term normally used… but I also add an extra “ed” on the end at times. In my opinion, the spelling of the label is one of the least of the T-community’s concerns.
In Matthew 5, Jesus states some examples of ‘calls to battle’: “But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, Raca [a term of contempt] is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.”
Mr. Espinosa wrote quite a ‘call to battle’. There are so many other forms of ‘calls to battle’ – insults, challenges, one-upmanship, reminders of the past, accusations of ‘agendas’… I think that the words matter little, the intent matters much.
But in Matthew 5, Jesus then states one of the distinctive marks of a mature disciple: “Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother; then come and offer your gift. ”
The call to reconciliation should dominate the calls to battle. Jesus said it, not I. Yet, sadly, many read His words… but refuse to pay the price of working through to reconciliation. Tis costly to talk to T-community, I admit we strike fear and repulsion in many. Tis costly for a T-person to reach through that fear, and learn to carry the burden of the other person. Reconciling the world was costly to God – it cost His only Son. I think that many are called, but few are willing to pay the price, of reconciliation. Sincerely; Caryn
Caryn LeMur wrote alot about Matthew 5. I do not agree with her take on Matthew 5. How can I reconcile with a sodomite who refuses to repent? He, not just his actions, are an offense to God and to Natural Law. St. Augustine wrote that to not chastise someone in sin out of concern of offending them (Political Correctness) is a sin in of itself. I am compelled to try in every possible legal manner to open the eyes of the blind for I am deeply concerned for their salvation, whether they want me to be or not. It is not I who am in danger of hell…at least not for this. It is the sodomite and he who assists and promotes said sodomite in his awful disgusting unnatural acts which are an offense to almighty God. You are right Caryn, the “call to reconciliation should dominate the calls to battle,” but when the sinner refuses to repent and continues to mock God, then the battle must be waged.
Stating that you hope the daughters of your opponents are raped shows concern for their salvation? Mr. Espinosa, I’m a pretty conservative Christian and, in essence, I can’t disagree with too much of what you say. It is part of a Christian’s duty to say what they think is right and what they think is wrong. I don’t think anyone here would disagree with that.
However, how we say it is important. We are to speak the truth in love. How loving are you when you drop the “F bomb” and say that you want women to get raped? Read James 3. You, sir, need to tame your tongue. There are many ways to “chastise” unrepentant sinners without resorting to vile speech. How many people do you think you’ll win to Christ in your insulting manner? Not many, I gather, which raises the question if you really want to win them at all. If an effeminate gay man, a stereotypical lesbian, or a transgender walked into your church one Sunday morning, just how accepting of them would you be? Would you even shake hands with someone that you see as disgusting? I wonder if you would.
Also, I hope that you are consistent in your treatment of sinners. If you treat “sodomites” like this, then you better treat liars, fornicators, atheists, Muslims, Buddhists, drunkards, and adulterers the same way. They’d better all be “disgusting” and “unnatural” to you. Otherwise you are putting your own personal feelings and biases higher than the Word of God. That, Mr. Espinosa, is also a sin.
Jay wrote:
I would personally hope that instead of treating any of the groups of people that you have listed as poorly as she treats gays, lesbians and transgenders, I would instead hope that she treat them all with respect and dignity.
I don’t come from the same world view as evangelical Christians. In fact, I would go so far as to say that I don’t really think that we even worship the same God. That having been said, I personally don’t view Muslims, Buddhists or atheists as inherently sinful. I view the world of sexuality differently and would have to evaluate each situation on its own merits. I think that alcoholics and drug addicts, although responsible for the harm they cause to others, have one of the most difficult illnesses to treat, and I try not to judge them for their actions that harm themself.
Gabriel Espinosa just admitted that a gay orientation is offensive to God as well. No surprise there. Regina is keeping them well enough inline with their hateful doctrine.
Thanks Mr. Espinosa for your loving concern. I feel all warm and fuzzy inside. It makes me want to rush out and become a conservative, loving, fundamentalist, evangelical Christian.
If repenting meant that I have to walk alongside Mr. Espinosa and speak the same lingo they do, I’d rather stay in what he believes is “my sin”.
Jay, it is all the same with these individuals. There is no love in what they say. If there is, I’m missing it. They are only trying to instill fear and self-loathing into people so that they will bow to their interpretation of what they (PFOX, Exodus, AFT, etc…) believe Christianity is. Their brand of Christianity is coercive at its core and not Christian in any way IMO. People like Mr. Espinosa just makes me dig my heels deeper into the trenches.
I believe Jesus would be very offended by their actions and lack of Christian love.
John, I wasn’t actually trying to suggest that Mr. Espinosa start treating more people poorly. I was simply saying that his hatred seems to be directed towards homosexuality only, even though most Church doctrines (not to mention the Bible itself) does not see it as being worse than any other sin. As Christians, we are called to hate all sin equally. We are only supposed to hate sin, though, not sinners. And as I stated, I’m not sure how Mr. Espinosa can claim he doesn’t hate sinners when he posts such insulting remarks about homosexuals.
There really is no need to argue this. I call on those who have anything to do with the subject to reprimand Espinoza (Is it Gabe – male or Gabriel – female? – I cannot tell).
Dear Gabriel:
I am glad to see that you understand the words of Jesus. You wrote, “You are right Caryn, the “call to reconciliation should dominate the calls to battle,” but when the sinner refuses to repent and continues to mock God, then the battle must be waged.”
In Matthew 18, then, Jesus shows how to wage the “battle” of reconciliation in four (4) steps: (1) meet with your opponent alone and reconcile; (2) then, if still unsatisfied, and there is no shared platform, bring in witnesses; (3) If still not satisfied, take the issue and witnesses to the authorities of the church (the church will issue a decision or an ‘excommunication’ to one or both parties); and (4) in time, the church must forgive. Step 4 is shown in parable form. [Steps 3 and 4 are then also demonstrated in I Corinthians 5 and II Corinthians 2.]
There is no limit to the number of meetings for steps 1, 2, and 3. Search for the platform on which you can agree. Understand the motivations for where you disagree. Restructure the platform accordingly. Escalate slowly.
Note that Jesus taught this was within the church and not within the state legal system – therefore, let ‘judgment begin at the house of God’, and let we that believe attempt reconciliation many times, before we dare to take issue with the state and non-believers [I Cor 5 also].
I also softly offer I Corinthians 6:1-7 for your consideration. Please. Let us not bring great shame to our Lord.
I am a fellow Christian to you. I live in Northern Virginia. I am certified with Gender Identity Disorder (GID), a transsexual, and what is called ‘post-op’. I write often to a group of about 1,000 transgender Christians. I am not offended by your language. I therefore offer that I am a good representative with whom to begin.
I am more than willing to meet with you to discuss your concerns of rape by a transgender person. It may take us time to find an expert witness that understands rapists, rape and rape locations. But I think, working together, we can find an expert witness to speak to us. We can develop a platform together to address the issue and your concerns. We can then publish the platform together. This is a good start, and would be within the bounds of our Lord Jesus and His words.
I am certain that another Christian would be willing to meet with you concerning your thoughts on “sodomites”.
Jesus said, “Blessed are the peace-makers”. Shall we try to live as our Lord commanded?
Most sincerely; Caryn
It’s funny, people on the right seem to jump in only to suggest reprimands (or to shame certain matters) rather than proceed the dialogue. Voice over: “Now, sinner you must sit in the back until you repent and say you’re sorry!”
Jay,
I have seen many of your comments on this blog, and I have perused your blog before. I think that you are inciteful beyond your years. I didn’t think you were actually encouraging Gabriel to treat more people badly; your comment just came off that way. It is difficult in this medium to communicate sarcasm, humor and irony at times.
Again, I have a good deal of respect for you and generally where you are coming from.
Sincerely,
John
Ken R writes – “Gabriel Espinosa just admitted that a gay orientation is offensive to God as well.”
Nice semantics buddy, but untrue as untrue can be. I did not state nor insinuate that a homosexual orientation is sinful or offensive to God. Yes, it is intrinsically a disordered thing, but a man or woman is normally nor responsible for having such feelings, as far as I know. So that pretended ignorance does not have it’s way in this forum, I will attempt to explain in more detail. The man, WHO REFUSES TO CHANGE, ESPECIALLY WHEN INFORMED OF THE TRUTH, AND CONTINUES ALONG HIS SELF-DESTRUCTIVE PATH, MOCKING GOD ALONG THE WAY, not just his actions, are an offense to God and to Natural Law. There, I hope the BOLDED text makes it clear to those who would twist my words for their own devious purposes.
By the way, no one controls me nor decides my mind for me. I speak for myself as should anyone with a conscience and a sense of the living God in their life. There is no “Regina…keeping [me]…inline…”
My intent in speaking my mind is not to make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside for in that sentence you have summed up what is the core of our problems as a society – self indulgence. Nor is it to convince you to walk besides me for my path is my own and I neither want nor need anyone beside me. Each has his own path. My concern is that your path lead to eternal happiness, not agony and regret. My friend, the temporal is just that – temporary. And what is the temporary when compared to the eternal? You concern yourself so much with your temporal rights, your temporal indulgences, your temporal dignity…and where will it take you? Not to Heaven. How about a little self sacrifice? But not self sacrifice for the sake of sacrifice or for your fellow man? Sacrifice for the love of the living God – Christ the King. That, my friend, is what will take you to your eternal reward, where the bliss you will experience will be so powerful there is no way to imagine it today…temporally. Listen to my words for they foretell the doom which awaits us all in the end when all arguments and battles will cease and there will be only The Judgment. Wouldn’t you rather be on the safe side than on the riskier side and not take a chance that you may be wrong?
Think about it.
Mr. Espinosa, I see you’re throwing in a bit of a Pascal’s Wager. How fun. I am certain you’re aware, though, that such “turn or burn” tactics have rarely, if ever, turned someone to true belief and faith in Christ. You speak of making sacrifice and being un-selfish. Yet you’re the one who’s speaking of faithful living as somehow deserving of “reward.” As if we, mere humans, deserve anything!
Do you honestly think that a homosexual will choose a life of chastity because of a fear of Hell or a hope of Heaven? Come on. We’re too far removed from God’s power to even know what the afterlife will be like. Our reason for faith is happiness in God alone, and our best method of evangelism is showing the love and truth of Christ in our actions. We should try to speak as He would speak and love as He would love. (I know, I’m starting to sound a bit like John Piper…)
Simply stated, if our only reason to believe is that we’re afraid of the consequences of non-belief, then we don’t really believe. We are to love God, not be afraid of Him. If you were really concerned for the souls of sinners, you’d be speaking the truth in love. The truth in hate may still be the truth, but it does nothing, because no one will listen to what you have to say.
If you speak the truth in love, though, you might just change a few hearts (including your own).
Jay, where is the hate in my words? Everything I wrote in my prior email was written in love. Keep in mind that without justice there can be no love and love cannot exist in an environment devoid of justice. Just so you know, there are homosexual men living a life of chastity for love of God and with hope in the eternal reward. Their’s is a tough life, but their witness to the truth is powerful.
Anyway, this is my final post to this blog regarding this current issue.
There isn’t too much hate in your previous post in itself, but if you take into context the e-mail that was the basis for this report in the first place (which was most definitely hateful and which you have yet to apologize for) then don’t be surprised if people take your future statements as being more hateful than you intended them to be.
As for homosexuals living chaste lives, you’ve been talking to one this whole time. Thank you for thinking that my “witness to the truth” is powerful. However, I do not like to take support from people like you who were, before my conversion, the primary reason I stayed away from the faith. Trust me when I say that it was most certainly not your brand of evangelism that helped win me to Christ (and certainly not to chastity). Take it from someone who knows, and try to watch what you say in the future.
Also, you’d do well to leave out the stuff about “eternal rewards.” Even if the Bible made no mention of Heaven and Hell, I’d still be doing what I do out of the love for God alone. Living faithfully because we think we are going to be rewarded is selfish, and I hope you grow to understand that.
Gabriel: I note with great sadness that it appears you wish to ignore my offer in this forum to make peace with the transgender community.
For those that have been following this thread, please consider that King David was never permitted to build up God’s house, because God said to him: ‘You are not to build a house for my Name, because you are a warrior and have shed blood.’ [1 Chronicles 28] The ‘call to battle’ has an incredible price attached to it.
“The envoys of peace weep bitterly.
The highways are deserted, no travelers are on the roads.” [Isaiah 33]
In my opinion, making peace is far more difficult than making war. Tis time for His travelers to walk upon His road that works peace. For only they shall be allowed by God to build His house. Please count the cost of the road upon which we each walk. With sadness; Caryn
You forgot to love us with Paul Cameron research.
Espinosa said:
Jim – Where is the dialogue here? Yes, this kind of statement should bring shame. If my webmaster ever says anything like this in my hearing or in public, he will no longer work for me. When Brian Wyant (gay webmaster and youth leader from Omaha) made outrageous statements about murder and mayhem, the people on this blog were all over it. Mr. Wyant no longer has his position. PFOX should take a lesson.
Gabriel’s insistence that he speaks the truth in love reminds me of the scene in the movie Saved! where Mandy Moore’s character screams out, “I am FILLED with Christ’s love!” as she throws a Bible at (and hits) the girl she’s trying to “rescue” from sin. Hilarious and dead-on accurate.
You’ve just admitted you do not really know if our feelings are “choosen” or not. So your opinion on this matter to me is moot.
Moving on…
Not really. I was referring to your brand of Christianity that is offensive to the real Gospel of Love. I cannot and will not subscribe to your brand of Christianity, Mr. Espinosa. My conscience will not allow me to do it. And I will not go against my conscience. I would have to abandon the real Gospel and pick up….*shudders* Let’s just say it would be a grave sin for me to do so.
I agree. My path is my own as well. And Jesus is the only one that can guide me down that path. Nothing you can say will convince me to leave that path I am on. I will not be lead astray by your words.
If the “temporal rights” and “temporal dignity” you are referring to have to do with ENDA, and other forms of civil rights that the GLBT community is working towards, they will never be considered temporal rights. They are human rights deserved by all people. Would you call your religious freedoms “temporal rights”? Would you like to have religion removed from federal protected status? If you would not like these rights removed, why not Mr. Espinosa? They are only temporal rights aren’t they?
I first and foremost profess Jesus Christ is Lord and the Word of God. I trust in him and only him. I will NOT worship the Lord in fear. Jesus himself stated that we are to worship God in love first and love our neighbor second which btw is the fullfillment of THE LAW. He does not want us to come to him in fear but in steadfast love.
Sorry Mr. Espinosa, you will not win a convert to your brand of Christianity today.
Gabriel Espinosa,
In addition, I would find a “heaven” filled with “Christians” such as yourself to be the worst kind of hell imaginable.
That’s one thing people like you tend to forget. You are the exemplification of the antithesis of a loving God.
And to suggest that such an eternal evil should be appealing, is the epitome of delusion.
Incredible… We are seeing the plank in Mr. Espinosa’s eyes growing and growing….
The plank in the eye metaphor with the forest for the trees metaphor.
Ripe for the mixing.
Very interesting, Warren where you say: “When Brian Wyant (gay webmaster and youth leader from Omaha) made outrageous statements about murder and mayhem, the people on this blog were all over it. Mr. Wyant no longer has his position. ” Please send some links (references) on this, I would love to learn more. Also, have you followed up on his status? Thanks.
You can read our coverage here, Jim. And yes, we followed up. He has his own sites but no longer works for or with the youth center according to the public and private statements of the leaders there. We have also continued to monitor the websites in question and the violent content has not returned.
Do you have information to the contrary?
Just to be clear, my investigation into the Omaha situation is the same as David’s. Mr Wyant was removed from his board position. My posts about the matter are here.
A thought on Christian love.
Jesus, when he said his followers would love one another also made clear that this love would be evident to non-believers. “By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.”
I wonder if those Christians who believe that their condemnations are dealt out in love have ever stopped to consider what “all men” know. Because the type of love Jesus was talking about wasn’t the type that is only recognized as “love” by other believers.
Thanks for the follow up, David and Warren. No, David I have no info to the contrary. Just reviewing the issue. All the best, Jim.
I think Gabriel went to the Fred Phelps school of evangelism.
Will probably achieve the same success rate.
Timothy, you hit the nail square on the head. I often have this thought whenever an evangelical poses the argument that God loves me so much that he wants to send me to hell if i don’t believe in Jesus. This is not an effective way to demonstrate love to Jews.
I got over the fear of hell a while back. And over
God’s ‘love’ too. Now, since im going to burn in hell forever, could u let us marry… PLZ. I promise ill tell all the ‘misdireceted’ gay christian ppl that their going to burn in hell, and the unbeliever too.. and ill use your above quote too. Then you wont blame me for ‘recruiting’ gay ppl. K?
“Not many, I gather, which raises the question if you really want to win them at all.”
Ah jay… but arent there just a few that will enter heaven?
You bring up an interesting point Joel. How is it ethical to blame someone if they truly don’t believe you?
Wouldn’t that be…Immoral?
“Wouldn’t you rather be on the safe side than on the riskier side and not take a chance that you may be wrong?”
I’ve never understood this logic. You mean to tell me that I can fool the Almighty God into believing that I’m a hard-core Christian? That’s essentially what this question suggests. “Oh just go along with it, just in case.” I’m pretty sure God can tell the difference between the whole-heartedly faithful and the “just in case” crowd.
I would rather be on the honest side. I’m not going to pretend that God hates his own creation (me) and demands that it completely ignore the sexual and emotional impulses that he gave me. What could be a bigger insult? To me, pretending I’m straight would be like hopping into a wheelchair for the rest of my life. I have two perfectly good legs, and I think God meant for me to use them. Sure, a wheelchair might be a safer mode of travel, that’s why hospitals insist on using them to move patients around —but there’s no reason an able bodied man should spend the rest of his life in one. And there is no reason why a gay man should pretend he’s straight.
Jason,
good analogy