Speaking at a conference of Exodus International, the largest religious group promoting the idea that gays can can change their sexual orientation, Rev. Jerry Falwell endorsed forcing gay kids into counseling designed to change their sexual orientation.
Falwell compared allowing a child to identify as gay with allowing children to play on the interstate and dismissed psychologists’ claims that consent is fundamental to a healthy counseling relationship and that parents should not force their gay kids into therapy.
Wow. Having been forced into reparative therapy by my parents (while I was still a minor) I’d like to offer my personal testimony of the harm it can cause.
Rev. Falwell, please be specific: What, exactly, is wrong with allowing your children to tell the truth about what they feel?
Falwell backs ‘reorientation therapy’ for gay, questioning teensUsāmah bin Muhammad bin `Awad bin Lādin backs ‘reorientation therapy’ for non-Muslin, questioning teens.OK — spot the difference.
This is the conference that Chad Thompson attended. I wonder how far his ‘loving gay people as Jesus would’ message went.
Chad sent me and email promising to call.
I gotta tell ya people-am I wrong to think he’s ill equipped to do anything profoundly positive for equality and freedom and the creed of this country?
People like Falwell, Tony Perkins and Dobson are so smug and secure in their finances and influence.
Chad is more into social persuasion, that I don’t think is persuasive…while FOTF, TVC, FRC and the CC are gaining political serious persuasion.
Would I be wrong to interpret Chad and other ex gays as people successfully repressed?
That they represent people who repressed their identity through intimidation and fear of the larger society who have taught all along to repress that identity and fear it?
If they go around preaching to their own choir that repression is possible….then don’t they see that’s EXACTLY the WHOLE idea?
I’m more inclined to wonder whether Christian fundamentalists’ kids ought to be sent to religious deprogramming camps. In fact, let’s send the parents along, too.
Kind of an aside to this. Has anyone been to Zach’s myspace blog lately? I was reading through some of the (over 2000) postings and I’m so inspired by the support he’s getting from mostly teenagers. There is hope.
https://www.myspace.com/specialkid
BTW Joe — have you put your own experience out there, for all to read?We do need to see these — actually “we” don’t… but others do.If you don’t have a site or whatever, or need help pounding it into a webpage — I’m more than happy to help 🙂 We’ll even host it for you, or perhaps XGW will.
It would be nice (in the spirit of fair reporting) if the article in question provided ACTUAL quotes of what Falwell said. Otherwise, the article loses validity.
Not that I like and support Falwell’s hatred, but by the same token, I do not support sloppy reporting.
John
scott
“I’m so inspired by the support he’s getting from mostly teenagers.”
I agree. Also take a look at the pics. It’s mostly kids with big smiles and upbeat positive messages of support.
What a contrast to the God-hates-you protestors that show up at pride events.
John: I agree w/your criticism of the article, I also would have liked actual quotes.
Grant: I have written bits about my experiences in reparative therapy in various places, including here at XGW, but I’ve never really told the whole story…maybe someday. To be honest, my RT experience overlaps with a bunch of other weird things that happened to me when I was a teen and I generally try not to think about that time of my life 🙂
Joe — thanks, we do appreciate what you need to consider.But that offer will stand. I can almost bet there’s a young fellow out there, somewhere, who could relate to whatever you have been through. Even to use us as a sounding board for your own hack at a “This Is My Life”. If and when, just ask, OK :-)The more we read, the both we consider ourselves blessed — apart from the internal obvious stuff when 14 15 16 etc, we both have the most brilliant families. How’s it go: “straight, but not narrow” — today was one of our birthdays, and a 3yo niece was FREAKING out all day waiting to ring and sing happy birthday to Uncle Dale. She’s an absolute hoot.
One wonders what other characteristics Falwell would consider warranting sending someone to a concentration camp for.
This is not an idle issue with me. My partner’s grandfather was interred in the Dachau concentration camp for some time.
Hi grantdale,
Caught your posts at DL Foster’s site. He’s really some piece of work. He’s so tiresome.
Anyhoo guys, I love ya.
I don’t care what Foster thinks of me, except that it’s interesting how much he gets wrong.
I really don’t think I can emphasize enough how much he acts and sounds like a segregationist.
I’ve been doing a lot research for a literary project, a stage play.
And I had to study the speeches of elected officials and groups that were formed in response to the landmark Brown vs. Brd. of Ed. decision.
The white citizens of the South and their protest against what they thought were judges legislating outside of their judiciary powers is very much like the rants coming from the Family Research Council.
Whites were very preoccupied with and paranoid of black sexuality.
Black males were dangerous, black females easy and compelling.
It’s the same now, gay males dangerous, lesbians easy and compelling.
A black Southerner like Foster doesn’t recognize his snobbery, his sense of superiority and where he’s most comfortable with gay people is so much like our nation’s segregationist forebears.
I don’t have the conceit to know what being gay is like and I won’t speak for gay folks and what gay folks feel.
But I do see how heteros like Foster and others speak of gay people and I get the picture.
Here is one black/native am/Irish woman with a mission. That’s true.
I’d rather die than behave towards gay people the way a white segregationist did in another time.
Our nation too late,it seems, realized the error of racism, even though we’re one race.
Now I see the same regarding homophobia, nowhere do we have the luxury of diminishing one another.
We should be wiser now, braver, more encouraged by legacy to understand our connection to each other and license it.
Foster represents the worst kind of coward for losing and forgetting history and his duty to it.
I call ’em as I see ’em guys.
You can correct me if I’m wrong….but as a woman of color, any other person of color that advances other myths, lies and a compromise of human rights to a fellow citizen should be ashamed of themselves.
Hi raj….you just reminded me when you mentioned your partner’s grandfather.
I just saw a production of “Bent” in my neighborhood yesterday.
It was about gay men sent to Dachau. The movie is out for rent if you haven’t see it.
Clive Owen plays one of the internees.
I was amazed that none of the cast of the play had ever visited the Museum of Tolerance here in LA.
One had been to the Holocaust Museum in D.C, but that was it.
I am a member and volunteer for the MOT and take out of town visitors every chance I get.
I was lucky, my parents had lots of books on the Holocaust that I grew up with and studied with them.
I think though, that these forced camps are a lot like my grandmother’s experience in Virginia with ‘the white man’s way’.
These reorientation camps are about following Jesus and the repression of one’s identity.
Becoming a slave to hetero identity and sensibility, rather than self determination in identity.
But ya know raj…
Despite the Holocaust on gays and Jews, and the decimation of native people’s culture here in the US-
gay people, Jewish people, first people….
Still they RISE!!!!
I just visited Zach’s site.
Not only does he have supportive friends, they are all kinds of kids.
Boys and girls, all the colors….
Zach’s life IS the rainbow, bless him and his friends too.
Says a lot about him, and his parents don’t trust that they have a good boy on their hands?
I wouldn’t trust Robertson or Falwell as far as I could throw them.
I’d trust Zach and these sweet friends of his…and let his heart tell me what love really is and means.
Hope swells….
I thought you might find this note by Josephine Ross of interest: The Sexualization of Difference. Her basic premise is that homosexuality and miscegenation were both sexualized to the extent that (in the popular mind) both sorts of relationship were viewed as having nothing to do with love and intimacy, but only sex. Granted, my use of the past tense is somewhat inappropriate, given such quotes as “the very word ‘gay’ is used to define individuals who engage in homosexual activity”.
And of course, it was not only blacks who were viewed as sexual deviants, but immigrants as well–such as Japanese, Chinese, and Filipino–and used to justify barring those people from marrying whites, as well.
RE: Skemono
I find that second link quite interesting and disturbing at the same time; the interesting part is the warped sense of reality that the author of the article has about the word ‘gay’ and homosexuality – has he taken the time or effort to realise that gay people, just like straight people, want a relationship, and that their life isn’t just about sex?
The disturbing part is the narrowed minded view of the school and their need to plaster posters around the school (and the money wasted that could of otherwise bought materials for classes), when the focus shouldn’t just be on tolerance but ACCEPTANCE of people, regardless of colour, religion, ethnic background or sexual orientation.
Tolerence ISN’T acceptable. If I were to say, “I tolerate black people”, it would be an instant flashing light as to saying I simply ‘tolerate, but don’t accept” – that is, being a racist. By the same token, how is accepting a person who is gay, against your religious beliefs? considering that in the bible ONLY sodomy is frowned upon – how do you know if that particular gay couple partakes in it? infact, is it any business of yours knowing what they do behind closed doors? they don’t come into your room and judge what you and your wife do behind closed doors, so is it necessary for you to go into their lives and pass judgement?
Regan, my partner’s grandfather was not in Dachau because he was gay.
But numerous gay people were sent by the Nazis to concentration camps merely for the fact that they were gay. One thing that you might find interesting to read is “Homosexuals and the Third Reich” https://www.fordham.edu/halsall/pwh/steakley-nazis.html
Actually, most of the documents on that web site are interesting. Look at the head https://www.fordham.edu/halsall/pwh/index.html
kaiwai at July 27, 2005 05:30 AM
I quite frankly don’t know how to respond to this comment except to say that I agree with it completely.
Just one point. “Tolerance” indicates condescension. That’s the long and the short of it.
Oh no, raj….I know that.
I’m sorry if that’s what my post implies.
No, I only mentioned it because of the context of the camps and in spite of the pogroms against them, Jews and gay people are still very much here and distinguished in society.
I know how many of the people arrested and bound for the camps were Jewish. Mostly Jewish of course. I assumed the grandfather was Jewish, not gay.
kaiwai…I agree with you too.
In spite of it’s name, the Museum of Tolerance is a venerated place in Los Angeles with an international following and visitorship.
It was founded by Nazi hunter and concentration camp survivor Simon Weisenthal.
It’s also called the Simon Weisenthal Center.
It’s a lot more than a Holocaust archive. It’s an educational center. Best of all, it teaches how to listen to and detect even the most nuanced forms of bigotry.
I”m proud to be an anti hate scholar.
The Center introduced gay acceptance materials and speakers to their educational programs for high school kids.
They are taught about the Nazi pogroms against gays and lesbians and there are exhibits and timelines involving the contributions of gay people all over the world.
We also have screenings of documentaries pertaining to this history.
PFLAG and GLSEN were brought in to educate the docents. Some of whom….were homophobic themselves on some levels.
That was a powerful time when that happened. And many of the kids who volunteer there came out or disclosed they were gay-we supply lots of tissues in that place.
I am always so grateful to bear witness to things like that.
When bridges are crossed, hearts are opened, minds are more completed.
‘Tolerance’ may not be the best word for the Museum…but the doings there are awesome.
I assumed the grandfather was Jewish, not gay
No, Regan, he wasn’t Jewish. He was an opponent of the Nazi regime. He actually was Lutheran.
One of the things that I have found interesting is the naivete of Americans. The Nazis ruled through organization and spreading fear. The Nazi regime had their “Gauleiter” basically people who would organize the populace. And, my partner’s parents and grandparents would listen to the BBC leading up to the war and during the war. They would send their dog out to the street to let them know if anyone was around who might “out” them. Some Nazi murdered the dog.
It doesn’t take a large number of people to “organize” a country.
BTW, we have a picture of my partner’s grandfather and he bears as startlling resemblence to my parner’s pictures from the same age.
Thank you for the correction, raj.
That’s the blessing of family. However unique we are as human beings, ‘wearing the face’ of a loved one is something great considering the tragedy of the Holocaust, and no way to preserve family objects.
I am a foresic artist as well as forensic photographer, and I put my name in for the forensic art service at the Museum.
Forensic artists are brought to volunteer for survivors to capture faces of their loved ones lost to the camps. So few survivors had any pictures left.
There aren’t many concentration camp survivors left for that matter. They are a national treasure wherever they are.
Regan, my partner’s grandfather was scheduled for execution at Dachau and would have been had it not been liberated by the American Army. His mother has told us the story a number of times, and she always ends up in tears. She also ends up in tears when we discuss what the American government seems to have become: an international bully.
I’ll leave it at that.