Christine Bakke, of Rising Up Whole and Beyond Ex-Gay, has been featured in an article in Glamour magazine. I first “met” Christine when she emailed me about a year ago. She’d just discovered that I live in the same Texas town where her sister lived at the time, and Christine thought I might be able to help her sister process what was going on in the crazy journey from gay, to ex-gay, to ex-ex-gay. I happily obliged and was blown away by the incredible LOVE I felt emanating from the sisters.
It’s a good article. Christine is not bashing ex-gays, and it seems to me she is quite graceful in her attitude toward them. Christine is telling her story, honestly, and is to be admired and respected for it. She doesn’t leave out the parts that might make her “look bad” and she isn’t attempting to make certain spiritual practices look silly. From the article,
“Then he put his hand on my head and I felt myself falling backwards. They’re all praying that the demon of homosexuality will leave me. I’m crying on the floor, having this religious experience and being told God loves me.”
Christine goes on to say,
“I don’t want to trivialize this,” she says. “It meant a lot to me at the time.”
Some things may look silly just because they look silly. So be it. I’m certain if God is truly in those practices, someone calling them “silly” takes nothing away from them. If there are things in the story that upset ex-gay ministries, then, so be it. Again, the proof is in the pudding, so to speak. It’s still her story and it needs to be told. We all have much to learn from one another.
Source: Glamour Magazine
Silly??? Hmmm, yes, well, umm, let’s just leave that as it is… eye of the beholder and all that.
Have I ever told you about the time we two (whiteys) were mistaken as the tour leaders of a group of speakin’-in-toungue Korean’s??? In Thailand.
My gawd, never been so em-bara-ssed in our lives. (and that takes a lot!) We’ve seen/done near most religiousity in terms of performance without any hickup, but that lot really pushed the envelop of screaming public silliness.
My point, and I do have one… nobody appears to trivilise or make appear silly any religious practise better than those most committed to them.
Pam, I know you will appreciate and get a good chuckle thinking about the two of us attempting to explain the 5 minutes of high pitched squeeling, wailing and general mentalness to an utterly bewildered (and, frankly, rather frightened) crowd of Thai people!
We said “Not know. They Korea. Ask them.” In really bad Thai.
Give us a break — we know enough Thai to order two beers but we certainly had no hope of “explaining” those taulkin’in tougue people! (and thank heavens, nobody asked us about juggling them snakes in West Virginia…)
PS hope you’re still in contact with Christine, despite moving towns blah blah. As always, we only wish for her to be honest, caring, content, and productive in life regardless of how she wishes to live it — not much more can be asked of someone, really, at the end of the day, can it?
I am thrilled that the story of lesbians are finally getting some converage. So many ex-gay narratives and articles about ex-gay experiences focus on men, primarily white Protestant males, perhaps the largest demographic in the ex-gay and ex-ex-gay pool. But the stories of trans folks, Asians, African Americans and women need to get out there too.
Hmm, yes, but, Peterson… but a “lesbian dialogue” doesn’t give much opportunity for anti-gay people to use the word “anal”. For some reason (g.o.k.) they are bursting to say “anal” in public at every opportunity, and these times are their only opportunity. I mean.. “lesbian” and “anal”… WTF???
Much, much more seriously — ANY opportunity to emphasise the scaldingly wicked situation faced by gay and black people deserves total support. Often stuck between racism and some of the most virulently anti-gay religious leaders where do young gay and black men and women look for support? “Us”? Where are “we”?
They type in “gay” and “black” and whadda they also get — some money-hungry-lesbian who has declared herself “celibate and so should you” (like, big whoopy-doo), or the gentle and erudite words of the maniac DL Foster when his attention is momentarily drawn away from Jesus speaking to him personally from out of the TV or pleading for gays in Barbaodos to be gaoled.
And what of Exodus? It almost makes neglect look good.
Having decided that huggy Jewish men are persona non grata at conferences but still needing that all important “mix”… they instead invite a black man who is a nasty anti-gay bigot. Welcome “Dr.” Ken Hutcherson — we’re sure you will be a sure fire way for Exodus to further it’s outreach into the homosexual-identified community…
The fact that Exodus — under Alan Chambers’ leadership — should even think “Dr.” Ken Hutcherson is a suitable speaker indicates exactly who much “love” and “compassion” that Exodus has toward people like us. Or even if they are intended to talk toward us, despite their pious words. But, hey, but look at his skin colour — it’s black. Woo-hoo!!!
Gawd, I’m gonna be ill.
(Alan: and we know you read this site. Please DO NOT BOTHER to reply with “Oh, I didn’t know that The Homosexuals(R) don’t like going to gaol or being called the evil spawn of Satan. I will change that type of speaker sometime in the future in Exodus under my powerful leadership”. Ring Colorado and invent a better excuse, okay?)
Thanks, Pam! And, for the record, I didn’t have anything to do with the title of the article (I think I would have said “I tried to cure myself of being gay!” or something along those lines; and who knows, I might have even said that in jest). But that’s just a quibble really. The article is surprisingly accurate. And like you said, I am really happy about the tone of it – A definite testament to Stephen Fried’s wonderful listening and writing abilities.
I really don’t seek to bash ex-gays. In fact, some of my best friends… 😉
Actually, like the article mentions, I am still good friends with Scott, who is a longtime staff member at “Where Grace Abounds” (WGA). Mary Heathman, the ever-straight founder of WGA graciously let Glamour do the entire day-long photo shoot at the WGA offices.
While I definitely don’t agree with everything they say or do, they probably are one of the few ministries under the Exodus umbrella that does some good (along with the potential for harm of giving people hope that their orientation may change, and recommending books from Elizabeth Moberly, Leanne Payne and others-grrrr). Exodus’ political ventures are so far from the spirit found at WGA that it is hard for me to believe sometimes that they are affiliated.
And I do need to add that one of the sad parts about my sister moving away from Pam’s town is that it is delaying me from getting to meet Pam!
Where Grace Abounds! One of the many ex-gay minstries I have passed through, and absolutely the most loving, accepting and least judgmental. I knew Scott well, and he in particular is truly a sweetheart.
The only thing I found a little weird at Where Grace Abounds is that almost all the members were having sex with each other, and no one seemed to mind. Mary, in particular, seemed to regard this as just a step toward healing! This was in the early 90s; not sure if they have the same attitude today.
I remember how discouraged my now ex-wife was when she went to the spouses meeting. The other wives were shocked to hear that we were still having sex. They just assumed their husband were all having sex with men, and no longer had relations because of the risk of contracting HIV. At the time, I was still completely faithful to my wife. They assured her that it would just be a matter of time.
I haven’t heard Where Grace Abounds mentioned in all my other reading about ex-gay movements. But it does bring back memories!
I found this article very refreshing in a sense. It seems that recently there has been a lot of attention given to this issue and to the “exgay survivor” perspective. I have found that many of these recent presentations are laced with disdain for Exodus and other “exgay” ministries. Thank you Pam for highlighting the respect, compassion and personal responsibility that Christine presented in her article. I wish more people on both sides of this issue would act and speak with these qualities.
I also really appreciate the clarification that Christine made about the title she would have chosen. It doesn’t bother me so much that some people decide “changing” their homosexuality is impossible. What bothers me most is the portrait of a victim, which is being displayed when attempting to discount “exgay” ministry. None of the ministries that I’ve been involved in have ever abducted happy homosexuals and subjected them to the evils of reparative therapy. The truth is, not everyone with these attractions is at peace with them. Some people choose to seek change in their sexuality. I don’t agree with the philosophies of some of the “exgay” ministries that I have come into contact with. I think some of them create unrealistic expectations for people seeking change, which all too often end in disillusionment and defeat. However, it is important to remember that participants even these ministries participate by their own choice. And many have left by the same power of choice.
I am so pleased that this article, and a few of this thread’s comments, highlights Where Grace Abounds. I have been involved at WGA for the past 6 years. WGA is the most loving and accepting environment that I have found in this realm of ministry. It is here that my healing and freedom have come the longest way. It is truly a testament to this ministry that people who have moved on from the ministry, and have decided “change” isn’t for them, still appreciate the love, support and encouragement they received during their time at WGA. One of the operating principles at WGA is “100% truth, 100% grace no compromise” It is clear from Christine’s article and Nick’s response that many people have experienced God’s grace at WGA. I think the truth part is equally important. May WGA never stop offering books and resources that give people hope! There is hope for freedom from shame. There is hope for love and acceptance. There is hope for blessing in our sexuality. There is hope!
Completely off topic, but this is worth noting if only for the fact that while reparative therapy is often criticized when done on consenting adults, it still mostly goes under the radar when done on unconsenting children:
https://www.xtra.ca/public/viewstory.aspx?AFF_TYPE=3&STORY_ID=2873&PUB_TEMPLATE_ID=1