AgapePress reports that Jerusalem WorldPride 2006 is scheduled for August 6-12, 2006. The event was planned for last year. However, the pull-out of settlers from Palestinian territory occurred during the scheduled time and the organizers recognized that coinciding events would be a strain on security and so rescheduled.
James Hartline, a “former homosexual” anti-gay activist in San Diego, has this to say about the planned event:
He cannot understand “why anyone would want to engage in sodomy and pornography at the holy sites of our religious heritage.” Hartline says that people in his church are heartbroken about the news of this event.
“Christians are crying at the sight of our Jewish brothers and sisters being beaten and removed by force from their homes in the pullout from their settlements,” Hartline says. “Then to see, in the midst of this tragedy, nearly naked homosexuals and pornographers march through the city is a cruel display.”
He continues by saying that “gay activists who regularly demand respect and special rights because of their claims of abuse and discrimination are clearly not willing to extend that same demanded courtesy to the hurting and wounded citizens of Israel.”
He provides nothing to indicate why he thinks that anyone would engage in sodomy at holy sites or why hurting and wounded heterosexual Israelis require more courtesy than hurting and wounded homosexual Israelis. And as someone claiming to be a former homosexual, he knows full well that the gay community has never asked for any special rights but rather that the special rights reserved to hetersexuals be granted equally to all. Apparently, Hartine feels no compulsion toward honesty.
Jerry Falwell also commented on the event:
Rev. Jerry Falwell believes the homosexual community is making a mistake in staging the upcoming event in the historic city of Jerusalem. “While the people involved [in WorldPride] are sincere, they must know that that the Judeo-Christian beliefs still see homosexuality as sin,” he says. “After 2,000 years there has been no shift of opinion on the part of Christians and Jews who believe in the Bible.”
While Falwell’s position may be shared by many Christians and Jews, it certainly isn’t the only position of Jews and Christians worldwide. Currently the majority of Jews in America are supportive of gay rights to some extent. And a sizeable percentage (if not the majority) of self-identified Christians worldwide are supportive of gay rights. In fact, it is in the “Christian nations” of the world in which the greatest levels of freedom and equality are found. It would be fair to say that there has been a significant shift in the opinion of Christians and Jews on the issue of homosexuality.
Falwell uses the term “who believe in the Bible” as a modifier, suggesting that pro-gay Jews and Christians do not believe in the Bible. I would suggest, rather, that they do not believe in Falwell’s interpretation of the meaning of certain scriptures and their application to modern life.
Falwell contends that homosexuality is a chosen lifestyle and that it is important for Christians to love homosexuals despite the disagreement over that lifestyle.
Still, the founder of Liberty University and the senior pastor of Thomas Road Baptist Church in Lynchburg, Virginia, thinks that El-Ad and other homosexual activists are making the mistake of staging their event in Jerusalem as a way of making an “in-your-face statement to Christians and Jews.”
Staging the event in the Holy City, says Falwell, “will hurt their cause internationally.”
It may be a testament to the spiritual growth and evolving understanding of Falwell that he comes across as the reasonable one in this report. Last year Falwell made statements that suggested that he was in support of laws protecting gay people from employment and housing discrimination. While Falwell does not support WorldPride, his criticism does not make bizarre claims or demonize the participants.
Conversely, it may instead be that the anti-gay rhetoric of the ex-gay activists has reached such levels of vitriol that Falwall appears moderate by comparison.
On a slight tangent…Remarkably, apart from one word in a single quote from an organiser, both Agape and Timothy managed to get through all this without mentioning the other religion to whom Jerusalem is also a holy city. They also make up a third of the city’s population, many more than do Christians.Not a criticism Timothy — I realise you’re commenting on Hartline — but the Agape piece displays one of the root causes of the conflict; an attitude of dominance and dismissal.
OK. Help me out here. I’ve never been to a Pride event. What exactly is it like? I’ll admit I do have a pre-conceived notion of what it’s like from pictures I’ve seen in the media. It doesn’t look like something you (Timothy) would want as your representation. I’m being completely and totally judgemental here based on my own limited experience. I don’t have a problem with the idea of the Pride event occuring in the Holy City. But I am wondering what it looks like.
As always, I’m being completely honest with you here and looking to gain a greater understanding and perspective of the situation. You know I’m not confrontational.
I appreciate (already) your gracious response. 🙂
grace
There is a documentary out called “Trembling before G-d” that might help you Grace.
That film interviews many gay members of different Jewish communities in America as well as Israel.
The Israeli Pride events don’t look any different than Purim events.
Purim is a kind of ‘freedom’ day where Jewish young people can dress up any way they want, play practical jokes and indulge in a few vices if they want.
Rumspringa is a similar event among the Amish and Mennonites.
Strict religious communities know that too much restriction isn’t healthy and formed these event in accordance to reality.
Israelis are a practical people, and Jews- have come around to being practical about the gay members of their society.
Jerusalem is simply a city accessible to most people in that region and helps to facilitate all kinds of events, not just WorldPride.
Education and understanding is a sacred endeavor too. So is self examination and confronting a challenge with an open mind. Handwringing over this event before it even starts, isn’t practical for a city that could use the money and profile as a safe place.
Obviously gay people are a fact of life all over the world.
It’s long past due that the world recognize it and not indulge primitive 5th century responses, in a 21st century world.
Jerusalem is an old city, and it’s survived a lot more than a collection of gay people there for a few days.
If they think that’s all it’ll take to usher in the destruction of it.
Their faith is terribly weak, don’t ya think?
The city’s profile won’t be damaged by WorldPride, nor will it’s station as a tourist or pilgrim destination.
Although Pride events in the US traditionally come around June, Grace.
A lot of local media often close in on the raunchy shenanigans off the track of what’s officially staged.
And that unfortunately tends to exacerbate stereotypes, and urges the handwringing revealed by this ex gay guy Hartline(?).
The Pride Parade in Los Angeles consists of some theatrical or Mardi Gras type performing Parade participants.
But there are platoons of firefighters and law enforcement officers.
Organizations that support gay people of various ethnic and religious communities.
AIDS and youth groups.
We have celebrity or political representatives in open cars and the floats are usually sponsored by all kinds of beverage, condom or food, or theatrical companies and unions.
It’s a really mixed bag these days and the parade can last as long a five hours.
The thing about those opposed to gay visibility and set asides for theme parks attendance or sports events.
They set up an obvious irony.
The more gay people are able to marry, care for their children and attend community events that concern everyone who lives there…the less Pride parades, set aside events, theatrics and all would occur.
But I think that deep down the anti gay love these events, that way they know where the gay people are and have something to point to and criticize.
They want gay invisibility, but at the same time are freaked by not knowing where gay people really are.
The double edge of bigotry strikes again.
Regan,
Thanks for the information. I will check out the information you’ve suggested.
I don’t spend time reading the Ex-Gay blogs that are referenced here but I don’t get the idea that it’s the “destruction” of the city, or even it’s morals that’s referred to here. It seems to be more of a desecration sort of issue. This is a Holy City to at least three religious/racial groups.
I agree with you completely, Jerusalem will survive. My faith teaches me that it will survive into eternity. I’m just curious as to exactly what we are talking about that is taking place here.
I do not and will never agree with people slamming the entire poplulation of gay folks with the sort of talk perpetuated in the article Timothy wrote about. I don’t agree with that. But I would like to know a bit more about the event. For some reason, the media only seems to pick up on the more sexually overt aspects of these Pride events. At least that’s what I’ve seen.
Again, my experience is limited. And again, thanks Regan for your help!
grace
When I first came out, I went to a few pride type events. After that I quit going, but I did march in one. I doubt that it has changed much over the years, but it has been a decade since I went to one. To me, the parades are not much different than a typical parade other than it is all gay. Lots of color and liveliness. The media tends to pick up on some of the more odd aspects of the parades, but I never saw that much that the media tends to present. To me, it was always a tamer Mardi Gras, but I only went to the ones in LA and Long Beach. Perhaps they are a bit wilder elsewhere. Sure there were drag queens and the occasional leather float, but for the most part such parades consisted of college groups, churches, PFLAG, and other organizations. I hate parades in general, so the pride parades never held much for me. The festivals, which are pay and private, have much more crazy elements I thought. They had the booths and things like condom distribution. I always thought the parades were much ado about nothing. I have heard people say there were sexual activities, but I never saw any unless people consider kissing or holding hands sexual. Never saw any body parts–saw more of those in college festivals and Mardi Gras. I think the best part of a pride parade is for the people who have never met gay people or are just coming out.
P.S. There was a video named Gay Rights not Special Rights or something like that. We were watching the video for a laugh or something and saw two friends kissing. The video was put out by an antigay organization. We asked our friends about it and knew nothing about the video other than a cameraman asked them to kiss for a “pride” video. It was all staged, and our friends did not know what it was being used for.
One unique thing about the parades I forgot to mention is the protestors. There are always very loud protestors from various churches or organizations that yell crazy things and have crazy signs.
Grace,This particular event (actually, events) is being run by Jerusalem Open House. JOH has been running local events for a few years and had decided to host WorldPride — basically same thing, but with an international flavour. The theme was/is “Love Without Borders”. All the photos from previous JOH marches that I’ve seen have been fairly tame, although some anti-gay groups have often behaved appalingly.As for what you can expect at a Pride Day event… urgh, not easy to answer.The parades generally take place during a week/month/whatever program of events; with most organised by different groups that have their own interests. Some are things you could take a Presbyterian grandmother to — such as Fair Days (which are basically a picnic in a park with rides and hotdogs. We’ve taken our young nieces on these days and they’ve had a hoot). Other events are adult oriented — such as big dance parties with music and alcohol. Other than the % of gay men and lesbians in audience these are like fairly much any other such occassions (loud music, attracting a younger crowd, and not appealing to many people.)And then there’s the Parades themself: these are many and varied, with the one’s held during the day fairly tame and the ones held at night much more like Carnival or Mardi Gras. The climate makes big difference too: the most showy are held in places with warmer weather (for obvious reasons!)Like those who march at Carnival or Mardi Gras, it’s generally an opportunity for some people to put together showy floats/costumes or for community groups to march under a banner. And like Carnival or Mardi Gras the whole area takes on a street party atmosphere. You either like that type of thing or you don’t, but the crowds are generally some of the best behaved you’ll find anywhere.With thousands of people attending you can certainly find individuals lacking much sense of decorum (or dignity!), but even the least dressed will be no worse off than a crowd at the beach. Until Sydney G&L Mardi Gras decided to go commercial we attended a number of the Parades and the crowds are overwhelming straight with lots of their children also enjoying the spectacle.I guess the easiest way to imagine it is to think of New Orleans and Mardi Gras or Rio and Carnival: even though the media will also focus on the showy or outrageous at these events nobody in their right mind would assume that’s how all heterosexuals behave all the time. There’s always a few loons in every crowd :)Generally it’s just an excuse to let your hair down for the night and have some fun.(For those that have hair, that is! The rest of us just have to content ourself with having fun.)You may enjoy these few photos from a recent Gay Pride. In this case, eveyone appears to be wearing tuxedos…
Aaron,That infamous video is called “Gay Rights, Special Rights”.Made by Jeremiah Films, released 1993, it is generally understood that Lou Sheldon of Tradition Values Coalition was ultimately behind it. Or a close ally, Springs of Life Ministries run by Ty Beeson in California, who distributed it free to every member of Congress. Springs of Life also produced another infamous video: the vile “The Gay Agenda” and have published swill by Peter LaBarbera et al. Their basic technique is to splice together 15 years or so of snippets from hundreds of gay-themed events together with a few anti-gay talking heads in lab coats and present this as just a typical day in the dangerous Gay Lifestyle(R).”Gay Rights/Special Rights” featured such experts-on-all-things-gay as Trent Lott, Ed Meese and William Bennett. They appear alongside the conspiracy nut David Noebel (Summit Ministries) and all the “facts” released by Paul Cameron. Readers may like to check out TVC’s “Homosexual Urban Legends” to give you a good idea of what the video itself is like.We once had a LDS member suggest we borrow it (to find out what this gay lifestyle(R) was really all about, as being a gay couple apparently doesn’t provide us with much information in that regard…) until we suggested they, in turn, borrow some of the other titles released by Jeremiah Films. They particularly enjoyed the fine selection about the Mormon lifestyle(R).You can, of course, purchase the “Gay Rights/Special Rights” video from many of the known allies of Exodus International.
Wow Grantdale! Thanks for linking those Mormon videos. Brought back memories–especially the Godmakers. I grew up Mormon, so I remember all that stuff.
I had a situation once as a teenager where a Protestant church positioned near the high school (they would give free pizza and proselytze) wanted to convert me from Mormonism. They told me that there was a Friday night party, so I got into their van and went to this house. Turns out the party was for me. It was some kind of Mormon intervention or something. There were about 30 people in the room when we arrived–pastors and fellow students. They told me that they were going to force me to watch the Godmakers and leave the Mormon church that night. When I said no, they blocked the door and told me that if I went home I would have to walk. They did not plan on me leaving until I was “saved.” When I tried getting past the door, it turned into a fight, and they tried holding me down. I got out and ran home–all 5 miles home. Needless to say, they never spoke to me again. My parents wanted to press charges, but I am not the litigious type, so I just wanted to be left alone. Of course, they said the same thing that the exgay groups do–we do what we do because we love you.
Aaron,
I can think of other incidents of bullying or intimidation by church leaders in smaller towns.
For years I was part of Matthew’s Place, a net community and website started by Judy Shepard.
Many young people who posted revealed similar behavior like this from their own churches, or if they didn’t belong to one, the local school would out them to a church for intervention.
I can only imagine.
I went to the ADF’s website and downloaded their information regarding “Day of Truth” and went over their list of answers to “hostile questions”.
I thought that was a strange way to describe inquiries into their version of truth, or what they expect to result from it.
They do use the same buzzwords over and over again.
“dangerous lifestyle” and “homosexual agenda” when describing what gay people are doing.
BTW, there is a beautifully angelic looking blond youngster posted as a model.
I think their new method of reaching out is still offensive, no matter how politely or how pretty the face that is speaking.
It’s still about the destruction of a gay young person’s identity by any means necessary.
I don’t care what your beliefs are, using fear and intimidation-and using God’s name, and government enforcement as well…is still tyranny unless and until groups like the ADF prove in what way gay people are dangerous or live at the expense of whatever beliefs they choose to hold any more than straight people do.
Grace,
As you can see, there are a lot of variations on gay pride events. Some are very political (San Francisco for example), some are very festive in nature (Los Angeles), some are more decadent (Sydney), some are more conservative (Fresno or Palm Springs). It all depends on the general attitudes of the area.
The reason for gay pride is to allow a sense of community, a safe space. Most gay people live their lives very much surrounded by people who are other than them. The vast majority of gay people have straight familes, straight friends, straight neighbors, straight co-workers, and attend a predominantly straight church. So it’s important to have one weekend a year in which the community knows that it can go somewhere and be in the majority. To be safe and let down their guard and not have to worry about someone else’s sensibilities.
Outside of large cities, there aren’t always places where people can go to feel completely comfortable other than a bar. Many people aren’t looking for a bar atmosphere and don’t want to be out at some gay club. Frankly, after a while, you get too old for that kind of thing, anyway. And many many gay folks are in couples and that’s just not part of their life. So here’s a chance to go on an outing, meet up with friends you may not see more than once or twice a year, and have a nice day. In many ways it serves the same purpose as a family reunion.
I know that what is presented in the media may suggest that gay prides events are decadent. But if we go by what we see in the media, Christians are all intolerant wackos with big hair and a cheap suit. The media can’t get ratings by showing normal people.
Interestingly – at least in LA – churches have always been a huge part of the event. Here one of the cofounders of the event in 1970 was a pastor and churches have always had a significant presence in the parade. Back a few years ago when I was on the local Parade Committee, the largest single participant was the Episcopal Church with (if I recall correctly) about 150 marchers representing about 20 different congregations. And there are always at least a dozen different churches or religious groups going down the street.
There are always – and probably always will be – groups that seem to be focused on hedonism. But in LA those are far outnumbered by churches, local politicians, health groups, social services, political clubs, athletic or interest clubs (ranging from runners to old car enthusiasts), theater groups, the gay police organization, the fire department with a fire engine (isn’t it funny that some firemen really ARE as cute as Hollywood makes them out to be), employee groups from area employers, and floats sponsored by business wishing to raise their visibility in the gay community.
My favorite gay pride story is about a neighborhood home owners’ association in San Diego some years ago that wanted to improve their neighborhood and raise property values. So they went down the street with signs inviting gay couples to please buy homes in their neighborhood. I have no idea if it worked but it always makes me chuckle when I remember it.
Grace, all of this very long response was to say that I would not want to associate myself with what has been presented to you as “gay pride”. But I don’t hesitate at all to associate myself with what pride events really are for me: a chance to see old friends and to remember that regardless of what some anti-gay legislator says and regardless of what some ex-gay minister claims, the gay community contains wonderful vibrant happy healthy people who have brought a great deal of joy to my life.
Grace,
Sorry. I didn’t address your other point.
I recognize that Jerusalem is holy to three religions. But it is holy to all of the various branches of those religions. It is no more holy to Catholics than it is to the United Church of Christ. It is no more holy to Orthodox Jews than it is to Reformed.
So I don’t think that anyone has the right to take offense and claim that their religous veneration of Jerusalem gives them the right to exclude others. If the Orthodox Jews can handle Shiite Muslems in Jerusalem, why can’t they handle gay Jews? If the Catholic Church can accept Lutherans, why can’t they accept gay Christians?
Jerusalem is home. And one sibling should not have veto rights on the family.
Thanks Timothy. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. The idea of events like gay pride does raise more questions for me to think about but none specifically related to the event itself. Maybe I’ll write some posts about it on my own blog. I suspected that the media focused on the decadent aspects of it so it’s good to hear another perspective from you as well as the others who were kind enough to answer. I have the same perception of Mardi Gras based on nothing but what I’ve seen on TV.
It was the decadent flavor that concerned me about holding it in the Holy City. Hopefully, since, as you pointed out, it’s Holy to the sects within the the religions, decadence won’t set the tone for this particular one. However, in the long run, I believe if God is truly offended by anything that transpires there, He’ll take care of it and it’s best to leave that up to Him.
grace
I have been to Gay Days at Disney (Disney World) a couple of times and to be frank, there was a much better spirit of good clean fun on those days than any other time I have been there. I would have no problem bringing children to those events and I am quite conservative concerning kids. It was simply wonderful! I had a discussion with some of the (straight) Disney employees on one occasion and they said they always try to volunteer to work during Gay Days because the tips are better and the people are nicer. Not sure what that says but I thought it interesting. You haven’t experienced Disney, or specifically the Magic Kingdom, until you’ve gone during Gay Days. And I am a Disney nut – I love the charm and fantasy of being able to be a kid again.
Now after being to those events myself, I saw some exgay propaganda footage (I think it was from LaBarbera but I am not sure) that depicted the entire event as one big sex fest that would put Mardi Gras to shame. Much of it was actually taken at Pleasure Island, a bone fide night club on separate Disney property – it’s always pretty intense in there. Some of the other clips were obviously of local parties that are held during the evenings at the same time. These are usually at gay bars and nightclubs and are about what you would expect from any event held in a bar at night. I was furious to see this depiction because I knew better from personal experience, but how many people do you suppose could say that? How many will take those images as what really happens at Gay Days Disney?
There was one time that I had my wallet stolen while at Disney, but that was during an all-night exclusive Christian event. Should I use that to justify some sort of negative image of Christians? Sorry for the rant, and it’s not aimed at you Grace. I’m just in a mood. There are times when I guess we all feel the frustration of such wholesale lies and deception being used to marginalize others. I’m human and sometimes I just want to scream.
David
I know. I feel the same way about alot of things and it upsets me as well. No worries! 🙂 And I certainly don’t take it personally against my question or concern. Thanks for adding your comments! I have a friend who goes to the Gay Days at Disney and also speaks very highly of it. 🙂
grace
I work at Universal Studios Hollywood, and the last gay invitational day they had, was pretty anti climatic. You didn’t really know gay headed families from the other families at the park.
There was a table that had giveaway bags, but those are everywhere. And there was ONE guy dressed bad drag.
Other than that, it was sooooo like any other day.
I do remember, on a regular day, stopping a two mom family at the end of the day, as they were leaving the park, after I’d taken off my Storm outfit.
The women had three BEAUTIFUL children with them. They were Latinas, the eldest was a boy about 13. They all had been so thrilled with Spiderman, Wolverine and Storm.
With all sincerity I told them I thought they were especially great to have with us, because they WERE’NT a shy family. The kids were so polite and full of giggles.
Their somewhat surprised response told me that perhaps not only it was possible that they didn’t receive many compliments, but they probably caught crap once in a while from disapproving wags.
The ENTIRE family hugged me gratefully and I picked up the littlest one, a girl of about five.
I told her that her two mommies were great ladies and she was a lucky little girl.
She piped up “I know!”
I’m with Timothy about the importance of being with those you care about.
I live for 365 days of smiles like that from ALL parents and their children.
No one should be left out of giving or getting hugs.
Yeah, Gay Days at Universal, Disneyland, and Knott’s Berry Farm were pretty calm and uneventful. If anything, the parks seemed safer on those days. Knotts is known for having lots of gang activity, but on gay days it is pretty calm. The only things that stands out are what happened outside the parks. There are always very loud protestors yelling at the park attendees with anti-gay signs. I have seen very loud arguments outside the parks. Also, many times these events are night events. Some of the families leaving the park see the gay families and will become somewhat freaked out.
When I have been with female friends on regular park days, one thing stands out–males try to pick up my friends. One friend actually had her underage son, and straight men would come up and proposition her in line talking very lewdly. My sister used to get the same thing. Those things never happened on gay days. Perhaps, people of the same sex were propositioning each other, but it never happened to me, and I did not see it happening overall. Gay days seem to be pretty clean fun overall.
Let’s be honest here. Part of what drives a gay pride march is the freedom to express oneself sexually. The religious community finds the kinds of displays that are often prevalent at these marches abhorent. There are certainly going to be the obligatory S&M adherents, drag queens, and other sexually rebellious folks in attendance. This is what is fueling much of the anti-gay feeling. Name any other ‘march’ that perpetuates this kind of behavior. You have the whole world to ‘act out’ in. Perhaps, in this case, the religious community simply wants to be left alone.
Yes, gay people exist and most people acknowledge that. What they don’t like is the blatant, in your face public sexuality. Show some respect. If you give respect you might get some.
If by “kinds of displays” you mean “gay people who aren’t ashamed of themselves”, then I guess that’s true.
Hey, wait; I thought we were going “to be honest here”. So much for that.
Yeah, cause that’s worked wonders so far.
“This is what is fueling much of the anti-gay feeling.”
No, isis, it isn’t. Selective videotaping and distribution of tiny fragments of gay pride events for the purpose of maligning a community may, indeed, fuel some anti-gay feelings. But nearly all people who would be offended by any “inappropriate” behavior aren’t anywhere near a pride event. The only way that they would ever know about the existence of such “acting out” is because anti-gay activists shove it in their face.
Which makes me wonder, isis, if you’ve ever been to a gay pride march. And if you brought a video camera.
If the religious community just wants “to be left alone”, then by all means leave them alone. Unless anti-gay activists shove this event (or really some small exagerated portion of it) in their face, they’ll never know it was there.