Everyone except the homosexuals; They’re not allowed to help “bring life and well-being to society”.
And while we’re at it, we’re not going to let them join the priesthood either. To ban celibate homosexuals requires homosexuality be viewed as an identity separate from actions. So… in this one case we’re going to treat it like an identity. However, in the rest of God’s absolute truth, there remains only “homosexual actions.”
Since there has been research indicating that the more male children a woman gives birth to, the greater the likelihood that the next male child will be gay,
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11910793&dopt=Abstract
is not the Pope in essense encouraging a practice that will bring more “intrinsic evil” into the world?
Pope: “Having children is a gift that brings life and well-being to society”
This is a joke, right? How many children has this pope fathered?
The hypocrisy of these people is stupendous.
Off topic, but y’all might want to take a look at this post on AMERICAblog.
Let’s understand the “logic”:having children is “good for society”. I’ve no particular problem with that.Pope says “Have even more, because there’s not enough.”Where that comes from I cannot guess…)heterosexuals actually respond to this call by a deliberate virgin and have more childrensome of these children will be gaythose children are oriented to an “intrinsic evil” that is harmful to society. More harmful, it appears, than paedophiles or an organisation that protects and enables them to save itself the embarrassment? And even rewards those in disgrace?Am I missing something here??? Or, is he.
Oh don’t you worry Skemono, we’ll get to it. I’ve already emailed the AFA, WND and Focus letting them know I look forward to their coverage of it.
I can’t understand this contradiction. If having childrem is a gift from heaven, why Catholic priests cannot have children and cannot even marry? No wonder sexual abuse is so commom in the religion.
Okay then…
Catholic priests, women and men who don’t have children…or ever marry.
Just take us out and shoot us all…
Well, of course-how would a priest justify someone not lining THEM up agaist the wall?
I wonder just how many would be attracted to the priesthood, an obviously chosen lifestyle, with such a pronouncement?
I’ll remember this when those of us who don’t have children are hit with double the taxes to support those who do.
The Vatican always has it’s hand out, or wants the more prosperous to pay for the poor he’s so eager to have children. Regardless of the ability to pay for or support them in any way.
This finger wagging from the Pope is getting on my last nerve.
You know, with 6 BILLION people in the world, haven’t we actually fulfilled the whole “be fruitful and multiply” edict? I mean, cross that puppy right off the “To Do” list.
Cpt. Doom.
Can I get a witness?
With half of that number living in poverty and disease…what KIND of frutiful and multiplying were they talking about?
Suffering to live? Deprivation brings us closer to God?
And all the Pope can do is wave at those hordes and tell them to pray?
If this suffering can be prevented through birth control, sexual self determination by females and greater respect for homosexuality (which doesn’t produce children regardless of situation, but the talent and compassion of gay people is a vital ability nonetheless) then what exactly is the problem?
Where is the sin in preventing suffering if the option is there and a matter of being informed?
Aha…
Ignorant and suffering masses is what gives the papacy it’s power.
A well informed public who demands to look behind the robes of the papacy is dangerous to that power isn’t it?
Kindness, benevolence and integrating women and men with equal power and opportunity and influence isn’t the real reason is it?
It’s no wonder creationism and other tools of maintaining ignorance are being demanded for schools.
The first thing to do in a malevolent religious agenda, is keep the masses ignorant and confused.
And then be the only ones around offering phony hope.
OK Regan, I’ll witness 🙂
Obviously you haven’t had much Catholism pounded into you — yes, “suffering is good”. For the very reason you suggested. Don’t ask me why, I don’t follow.(It’s one of the reasons the church is dead against — /snort — voluntary euthanasia.)
Regan DuCasse at September 2, 2005 12:25 PM
It’s no wonder creationism and other tools of maintaining ignorance are being demanded for schools.
This is true, but I’ll merely point out that evolution will continue to occur regardless of what is taught in the schools.
As a slight aside to the topic of the post, if the pope wants my sperm–for use in procreation–he can get it via a fertilization clinic. To be blunt, penile/vaginal sex hasn’t been required for decades. One would guess that he has never heard of In Vitro Fertilization (IVF). I won’t do it–I believe he’s a wacko, anyway–but it would be possible.
Hi Grantdale!
No, I didn’t have a lot of Catholicism pounded into me.
And a good thing too. I’m not so hobbled in my thinking about Scriptural absolutes.
Which only seem to conveniently apply to easy and vulnerable targets.
This isn’t courage.
We are a species blessed with taking pleasure in the beauty and bounty of creation. I thought it was EXPECTED that we enjoy our lives. But to have all amazing and pleasurable things and people around us, then selectively and cruelly decide (with prejudice) that we are to deny ourselves (or others) is mean and most of all, proven to be impractical.
There are ways of having and taking pleasure, and doing so without creating suffering or betraying another of our species.
The sad part is….most strict religious communities don’t know how to teach those differences and distinctions or learning from the past mistakes of it.
There are plenty of us not strangled by these contradictory edicts. And the Vatican on down, seems to resent a greater wisdom in the populace, than what comes from the Pope.
Take the Spanish legalization of marriage and adoption for gay people for example.
The protests from the Pope on this issue, compared to the reasoning for it from Zapatero, illustrated fully from what camp compassion came from and what camp bigotry did.
For someone like me on the outside looking in, this isn’t the first time one could look behind the robes of the Pope’s office and just deem him unqualified to lead based on Scriptural morals, but more universal moral themes.
Years ago, Pope John Paul praised an ad campaign by Bennetton clothing manufacturers, that featured the worst death row inmates with soft focus color photos and quotes of personal philosphy from the subjects. It was an anti death penalty campaign.
However, pictures of gay couples and their children in pro marriage campaigns has offended the pontiff.
And he’s never been against murderers having the option of marrying.
This is why moral objections to gay participation rings hollow before these facts.
He’s more in favor of people who CAUSED suffering, rather than people who he CONJECTURES will, not who actually have.
It’s this sort of example that makes me have no respect whatsoever for the Vatican.
That and that itchy little sex abuse thing…
Hi Reagan,Well see, you gave away your background again :-)The Vatican does not base its views on scripture (as in, biblical). It combines that with a cover-all term called “Tradition”. Basically, tradition is whatever they had decided in the past and have not dropped (or quietly stopped mentioning) to date.This is the main difference between the Church of Rome and the protestant movements (who rejected papal authority and base their faith on what’s written in the bible). There’s also a strong line of “mysticism” within R.C. that is rejected by most protestant churches — the prayers to the saints, visions of Mary etc etc. It’s more aligned to the Orthodox churches in that regard.If you’re interested — I dunno, maybe you’ve got a slow Sunday coming up — the differences can be clearly seem by attending a “High Anglican” and a “Low Anglican” service (that would be the episcopal church for you). One’s nicknamed “Bells and Smells” for a good reason 🙂
Ooooooooooh….tradition.
Yikes, an even worse excuse!
I was THE luckiest kid when it came to learning about religions, as opposed to being corralled into having a faith.
My father liked his native american traditions, and commiserated often with his native american mother in law (my grandmother Lili’ah)pronouned (lee-lah).
The two of them were willing to attend Episcopal church, because they really liked Father Williams as a friend and neighbor.
I remember their visits together around the dinner table.
My father also attended temple with my mother’s Jewish friends and MY Jewish friends growing up.
Most of my worship service attendance has more to do with the love of my friends than religious faith.
I hope for compassionate and progressive discussions in religious homes, not contentious ones.
I have noticed though…that the Jewish community is reaching out for gay folks in ways no other has or will.
And that’s the difference between Jews and some noted Christians.
Jews say ‘maybe’ and question things.
Some very powerful or pushy Christians are saying ‘always’ or ‘truth’ and don’t want their faith questioned.
Jews are willing to reject past mistakes of former belief systems that compromised a fellow human being that didn’t violate them or they felt a need for self defense from.
Starting from personal experience….Jews simply found it harder and harder to reject out of hand, beloved sons and daughters who are gay.
It’s this that has created more liasons between Jews and non Jews, people of color and Jews and gay and lesbian acceptance.
This same holds true for Buddhists and Hindus.
Christianity and Mormonism are the relatively new kids on the block.
They are raw and have a much longer way to go as far as grace goes.
It’s just they keep kicking off the path, the very people who could get them there the fastest.
There is more of a rush for power, rather than grace because of the newness.
A good many other Christians realize this and know better, and these are the ones you see welcoming all to through their church doors and into the pews.
And make no speeches that are hateful or that strike fear of other human beings.
I’m willing to go everywhere my brothers and sisters can go.
That’s all.